making a walk cycle

Yes I do Scattered, all the time.

But Mighty Mew is in my opinion, although new to the medium, a very promising animator and artist to be. Remember that when Pixar responds to your job application.

You know why? Because Mighty's the one who'll be able to handle 568 rejection letters, knowing that the 569th will be that well awaited letter of acceptance.

Adam

There aren't as many of us, but a minority of valuables is still valuables...

I think even for talented students, you raise a good point. Especially in fields like illustration where there are fourteen million-odd people that can paint at genius level or so it seems...personality can be everything that separates you from the pack...not just in dealing with other people....but in dealing with yourself...

Taking criticism like a grown-up is healthy and I'm happy to see it...But also knowing and living with the fact that determination is not just making things happen, but continuing to be determined when they don't...

P.S. Just re-read my original post...I wasn't saying it like "You're impressed by HIM? What, are you surrounded by garbage?" I was actually honestly curious. There was a thread some time ago when I spoke with a teacher on here who works for a private art school and he'd made a comment about people that slack off in spite of being at a great place that costs out the wazoo...same kinda wondering...

Hello, Hi, I'm an animator!

Here's my input...

First ask yourself- what is the character's emotion? Then you will know how much weight to add...it's an important step along the way.

Second, did you do thumbnails? If you didn't then go back and do them!

If you want to learn to animate then THINK like an animator. Don't just move the character around...THERE SHOULD BE MORE PURPOSE THAN PROCESS.

Once you have figured out that info...then you are ready to begin.

If you are after a more joyous or buoyant walk then reverse the spine during the passing pose.

Check out my walk cycle lesson at http://www.awn.com/tooninstitute

Some info there you can use...

Have fun...others here will help with the logistics.

Thanks.

I don't know Maya, yet, but Scattered is absolutely right about the first and last frames. I don't know if this works this way in 3D as it does in Flash, but I always duplicate the first frame as the last, animate up to it, and delete the last frame. So if it's a 19 frame walk cycle, frames 1 and 19 are exactly the same. Then when I'm done, I delete frame 19 so there are now only 18 frames. But like I said, I have no idea if you can even do that in the 3D time line.

As for the walk, never mind the finger moving. Concentrate on the bigger movements and work your way tighter and tighter. If the walk is off, it won't matter how good you animated that finger. So the walk looks pretty good. It has all the basics there, although it's kinda hard to tell with out seeing the arms and legs. It looks like the hands stop at the end, but that just could be the loop sticking. If it's a cartoony walk, you should throw in a lot more movement to the body and head and play with the timing more. Really push it. Have the body really sink down into the step and the hip push out opposite the leg when he comes back up. Then rotate the shoulders opposite the hips and the head opposite the shoulders. You have a good solid walk cycle to build off of, now I think you just have to play around and experiment with it.

Aloha,
the Ape

These guys know what they're talking about, and all the advice above is right on.

There's another approach to looping as well. As mentioned above, make sure that your first and last frames are identical. Use the channel boxes to copy and paste the exact coordinates from the first to the last frame.

From there, in the graph editor, make sure that all of your curves end smoothly. This means that you want them to level off horizontally towards the last frame. A quick means to doing that, is to make sure that all of your curves start at the first frame, and all end at the last frame. You then select all of the keys on your curves that are at frame 1, and hit the button that flattens all of your curve editing handles horizontally. Then of course, do the same for all of the keys at the end of your animation.
This makes sure that when the last frames loop back to the first frames, that there isn't a "pop" or "jolt". It makes the transition seamless.

One last thing that you can do at that point is to set a key for all of the curves, at the "second" to last frame, and finally, delete all of the last frames.
Because the first and last frames are the same, you'll hold for a split second longer on the last frame. It's almost unnoticeable, but if you really want your animation to be flawless, each frame should be considered.

Finally, once you've reached that point, select all of your curves, choose "post infinity" then "cycle". This'll cause your animation to loop forever. If you only want your animation to loop a specific number of times, then choose "post infinity" then "loop", and enter the number of times you want your animation to loop.

Bingo.

Adam

PS...regarding the unanimatable dedo (finger), are you sure that you have a key set to frame 1 for that particular transformation for that particular bone?

Hello.

I think it's great that you have stayed so long with this one...I think it would have been easier for you if you animated it first in 2D before jumping into 3D. A lot of the challenges you have had would have been worked out eons ago. Thumbnails would have been very valuable.

I can say this because I know this person...

That said, here are a few pointers...

Show more transferrance of weight on the feet as the body moves over the feet. You have some initial SQUASH (weight) in the feet and the SQUASH should become greater as the body puts more weight on them.

The reason the BODY looks mushy is that you are reversing the spine by using an "s" curve. Don't use an "s" curve- just pop it the other direction in the passing position. "s" curves can make the body look mushy. Pop the spine back the other way as the passing foot comes down.

Yes, the hands and feet are generally work opposite each other.

Remember with the structure of the body - the hips ALWAYS work opposite because they are ball and socket joints seated in the pelvis. The shoulders are independent movers because of their construction. The arms and legs work opposite because of balance and counter balance- the body is on balance until the foot coming forward in the passing position - passes the the leg making on the ground - then the body is usually off balance and until the passing foot makes contact again with the ground.

It's great you are trying to learn this important info - draw out thumbnails and don't shortcut the process. Sorry, my professorial splendor kicked in...

Thanks.

Look here...now you've got Larry helping you out. hehehe....I think that's where the phrase "don't worry, be happy" was coined.

Needless to say, whatever advice you get Mighty, cherish.

Adam

PS.

..I'm sure that Larry, or any other experienced animator would recommend that you "act out" any and all animation that you put yourself to, yourself. Get up and move. While you're doing it, take the time to focus on every part of your body seperately. (ie...spine, hips, shoulders, arms, hands, legs, feet, face etc...), and as Larry had said...with a pencil and pad at the ready, sketch out what you're doing. this way you can reffer back to your drawings while you're sitting at your computer posing your character..you can either use a mirror as reference, so you can watch each pose, and the positioning of your different body parts. If you're going for the "feel" of your animation, close your eyes and pay attention to tension and weight as it you feel it in your head. Whatever works best for you.

what's important is that you're taking your learning from real life, as opposed to what you think something's supposed to be like. There's a big difference. And because you move and act differently from everyone else, a good observation of your own movement will always bring original results.

Hey, this is the first time the majority of my post was in the PS section.

Indeed, I find that while learning the mechanics of animation is important, whenever I try and take it to the next step away from know-how and formulas, and make it my own with actual personality, acting it out (not me doing the moves, literally acting) gives me a sense of the TIMING of the move, and that communicates everything that the textbook stuff can't.

Even with something as simple as knocking on a door. Someone who just got up will have vastly different timing and motor skills than someone who's been waiting for a hot date for an hour. Bring that in, and really get it right, and you're way better off...

As for me I am still mostly working on making sure my technical prowess is up there.

I agree with everything he's been saying Mew. And your animation looks great.
Also, I thank you Adam, for you have taught me a little bit as well.

Hello.

Obviously, it's okay to do both...2D and 3D. It will make it easier on you if you do 2D in the form of thumbnails- before the 3D. Believe me, it seems to happen to everyone pros and students alike - when planning out your work just do the thumbnails and then you have a guide.

3D animation is so "process oriented"- its good to have a road map and thumbnails are that road map.

Thanks.

You thought you could post your ideas on an Animation Forum and not be pegged to the wall with advice....You chose poorly my friend...You chose poorly.

But don't forget Mighty, that you wouldn't be getting all this advice if everyone didn't already feel that you were serious about your project. It's a fun one...difficult, but fun. I didn't the same thing when I first jumped into 3D, starting with designing a character, then giving him a walk cycle. It's a huge project to take on when you're starting to learn 3D for the first time, but a great way to jump-start your learning. Once you've gotten the walk down, taking on many other kinds of projects will be much less challenging.

Adam

My school also started off with the first main project (ie outside learning the layout or buttons) of a walk cycle. Akin to what Adam said, there's something to learning as you go along, and if you're only concerned with mechanics, it's a very good way to start to feel out the work environment.

It applies your knowledge into a practical purpose, so all of the kinks you hit require problem solving in an actual context. You break something or wanna do something a different way, all of the sudden there's this specific focus that what you decide depends upon.

Thank you Hyperblade...I know...half of what I learn is by rubber necking into other's conversations. I like to crash parties...it's my thing. follow? hehe.

And Mighty Mew...You're NAILING it! Dead on man!
It's crazy, I scrolled back up (if you haven't yet done the same yourself), and checked out your first version. It's a world apart.

Listen, you've got what it takes to become great. You work like a dog, and you're a perfectionist. Combine that with talent, and you're on your way to doing very well for yourself...trust me. You just keep doing it over and over. And the funny thing is...you actually listen to me...BWAAAAAHHHHAHAHAAAAAAAA! Sorry...ahem!

so yah, if you're still sane after all this work...then you might have fun adding a few things to give your walk some real UMPH! Add some weight and fluidity to really make it dig into the ground.

As I'd already proven earlier into our conversation, drawings speak louder than words, so I went and did a few to explain what I was after.

SPINE - FOLLOW THROUGH:

- Look at the spine of your character...or at least, where the spine is supposed to be. I've drawn an orange line to show you the bend of the spine as it takes the weight, flowing like a blade of grass in the wind.
Remember that anything that flows, or bends, has to bend from somewhere. It's your job as the animator to find out where that beginning is. Where that driving force is. In the case of your character (or BIPED as popularly known in the 3D world), it's the hips.
The hips tilt back and forth, working like a hand grasping the handle of a whip. And as the hand bends forward, the spine flows out, then whips back, with all of the vertibrae of the spine following in succession.

When looking at the 3 or 4 or more bones that you've placed up the back of your character to make the 3D spine, then it's the same principal. First the hips will tilt back as the rest of the spine continues forward, then the hips and spine 1 will flow back, while spine 2, 3 and 4 continue forward....then hips, spine 1 and spine 2 will flow back, while spine 3 and 4 continue forward...then hips, spine 1, spine 2 and spine 3 will flow back, while spine 4 continues forward....then finally, the entire spine will be curved in the opposite direction, flowing backward.
This continues on back and forth, creating a smooth flow through the spine.

- TIMING:

Where does this all go, and why?

Well, Like I mentioned earlier....a walk is like a series of controlled falls. You lean forward, and right before you fall on your face, your foot comes out in front of you and catched you. (If you want your character to trip and fall flat on his face, then put something in the way of the catching foot, and you'll see what happens!).
So with all that said...if you look at the first illustration, you'll see that at the first pose, where the body is at it's highest, standing straight (passing position), you'll see that as the body falls forward, the spine flows in an arc.
Once the heel of the foot "catches" your character from falling, all of a sudden, all the weight falls onto that foot. That weight travels to the hips, and they lean forward, then all of the vertibrae of the spine follow in succession. The, as the character pulls itself back to the original passing position, the spine flows back up in an opposite arc, lifting the weight of the upper body.
Then, as if the character didn't learn the first time, he starts to fall forward again, starting with the hips, all the way through the spine, until he catches himself with the other foot, and so on...

The second illustration is just the spine, to give you a closer look at the follow through. What you're really looking at is the orange dotted line...the body does it's best to respect that line.

Another important thing is "HOW MUCH"? How do you make it look natural...hence...not to little, not too much?

That's your job. My suggestion is to go all out! Give your character a nice follow through, and if he's jerking around too far, then reduce it bit by bit. Make it a little less dramatic, until finally, it just fits.

You can also use that technique in greater or less quantities to increase the feeling of weight, or decrease it. If you have a very dramatic sudden whip of the spine, it can make the character look tired and heavy. If you want the character to be a weightless and agile elf for example, you can keep it light and subtle...that's up to you, but remember that timing plays a factor in that. If your character is going to come down hard on a foot, then you have to start the fall slowly, and right before the foot hits the ground, the fall of the body will speed up drastically, and "slam" down on the floor. The spine will feel the power of that hit, and whip forward hard.

All I can say mighty mew is...you've got a nice looking walk going on.

Adam

And here's the spine!

Adam

I have been observing that myself lately, that last little insta-twitch before a major position change. You can see it in the fingers snapping back - who said follow-through had to be loose?

interestingly, you have your hands swinging out during the lift or crossover.
it's like the hands are leading the feet.

cool.

You submitted an updated movie in the post immediately before...

I was commenting that in that movie, a particular nuance produced in your character's motions is something I myself had picked up on...

"insta-" is short for instantaneous, and the twitch is just a flick of the fingers right before the hands/arms go back to the opposite/original position.

Kukut made a good point....It looks as though the hands are at their widest point around the passing position.

Although it makes for an interesting walk, the more "traditional" approach to arms, is that they're at their widest part at the frame when the body "takes" the weight, right after the heel touches down, like I'd mentioned in my last post.

A good rule of thumb for that is "opposites", which is something that noone's discussed yet. Remember, "Hands opposite feet", so when the right foot comes forward, the left hand should come forward as well. Same applies with the left foot and the right hand.

When you get into arms, legs, hips and shoulders, you'll see how that rule applies to the rest of the body.

In any case, keep up the good work, you're starting to gather a fan club.

Adam

Why does follow through have to be loose?

Follow through is a way of showing flow and weight. More specifically, it's the act of physics...how the force of one thing effects another.

Take a ball...a small light tennis ball. Someone throws it at you full-force. When you catch it, the energy and weight of that ball is transferred into your hand, and so on up your arm, shoulder, back etc...Seeing is how it's just a tennis ball, the transfer of energy might only be strong enough to travel up to your shoulder, even at full force.
Now take that same example with a big, heavy bowling ball, or a medicine ball. Because the weight it much larger, when you catch it, a great deal more energy and weight is being transferred. The energy will transfer quickly through your hand, arm, shoulder, back, hips, and even down to your feet. It might travel through so fast and hard, that you're forced to take a step or two to absorb the full transference of energy.

Well, keep that in mind always. We're constantly faced with different weights, speeds and angles coming at us at all times. How we lift a bag, as opposed to a frying pan...how we lift a toothbrush or iron...how we need to position our body to lift certain things...like keeping our feet wide, and our back arched to balance ourselves when we lift a piano for instance.

Now you know the tough thing...follow through. You understand the concept....the obstacle that you're running into now, is "to what degree", and "when and where" that energy is being transferred.

Look at your characters back...there's a reason why his back is following through...it's the feet, hitting the ground. The weight of the legs falls onto the feet, then the hips drop and lurch forward afterwards...the lower spine falls forward from the energy of the hips...then the middle spine, then the upper spine, then the neck, then the head......then the hair. It's a transferrence of energy...not just a movement. There's a purpose to the movement..and if you can understand that fully, and how much, you'll nail it right on. In order for it to look right, and convincing, it has to convey the right amount of energy in the right place at the right time.

With this in mind...try this out..

Hit "play" on your rendered walk cycle, sit back with a cup of coffee, and stare at it...relax in front of it....before you know it, you'll start breaking it down, and the answers will come to you. The longer you observe what you've done, the more you'll figure out.

And don't forget to take a break once in a while, or you'll go blind, and you can forget being an animator. hehe.

Adam

Finger-flicking isn't a bad thing at all -- it adds a touch of realism.

And nobody said follow-through had to be loose; that was actually the point of the comment...

Oh Mighty one,

Well, there's alot more life in this one...he's got some energy and spunk in him...very nice.

One thing to consider is his center of balance. If you look closely, you'll notice that he's leaning back a little too much, which in reality might make him fall over.
A good way to cure that problem, is to always pay attention where his head is in relation to his feet.
If the person's weight is spread equally across both feet, then the head will be between them....if the weight is completely on one of the feet, then the head will be over the foot taking the weight.

stand in front of a mirror and look at how your body takes the weight in a normal relaxed pose. Look at the gentle angle of your upper body from a side view...look at how the your neck will naturally lean forward a bit, or where your arms hang...stuff like that.

Aside from that, it might help with your next project to do a straight ahead walk, instead of doing a walk "cycle". It's an easier and more effective way to get the true weight distribution, foot placement and movement of the body. If if your walk doesn't work for one reason or another, you'll see it right away, and you'll know why. After that, try a cycle again.

But you've taken on probably one of the most challenging things to do in animation, which is the walk, so this will be a huge learning experience. Keep it up.

Adam

Feels more fluid now, good job. And do you mean funky as in things break like a bad IK setup, or you mean it looks ridiculous? I'd like to see ridiculous...we are in the business of making cartoons, after all...

Not bad, not bad...

Just a few pointers....it looks as though you've leaned the body back again, which in reality would lead to the character falling backwards.

Don't be shy with leaning the body forwards...remember that natural physics makes a body lean in the direction of the movement. If the person's walking forwards, then their body with lean forward. The faster the movement, the bigger the lean. But don't be shy, put your back into it...lean in nice and deep, make your character heavy, give it some meat and bones and bounce!.

The other thing, is EXACTLY what I struggled with working on achieving the same thing you're doing right now. After you've leaned the body forward, then look to see if the spine follow-through that we've discussed is properly timed. What I mean by this is...check to see if the body is rising and falling and swaying with proper respect to the foot movement. Walk across your room, but exaggerate it...pay attention to your spine, and see where your body naturally curves and leans. Doing the action yourself is probably the best way to solve problems like these, with any type of animation.

So keep working on it...I can't believe your perseverance.

Adam

Are you normally surrounded by quitters or disinterested folk? Mighty's 'one of the good ones'...people who give a durn and really -care- about what they're doing so they invest themselves in it... A Mew after my own heart :D

EDIT: ones -not- meaning one quitter lol

okay looking at the color of the layout and the "default" lambert color I assume you are using maya. I could show you how to do a walk cycle but I would not know where to start from so I suggest you go to either CGtalk or learning-maya.com and do a few tutorials.

Hey Mew,

to make the cycle loop, make the last frame exactly the same as the first. To do this, select all your character controls, go to the first frame, then middle mouse drag across the time slider till you hit the last frame. Then press S to set key on all the controls. Middle mouse dragging will slide across the time slider without scrubbing through the animation so the values will remain the same. Very useful for stuff like holds.

As for your other technical problem, there might be some constraint on the pointing finger that would prevent you from animating it. To get rid of all the constraints and keys, right click on the channels in the channel box that you want to animate (translate, rotate, and scale) and then right click and select "break connections"

As for the walk itself, the hips look too stuff. Show some shifting of weight by having the hips lean on the foot that's on the ground. You could also loosen up the head a bit by having it come down on the recoil and put the up extreme between the passing pose and contact.

I thought the question was about the black frames, not a full loop. I was taught to have the first and last positions be the same too, but you get the two-frame-of-same-thing bit on there and it sticks. Since it's all going in a consistent timing flow right now have the first or last frame spaced approximately one frame's separation from the other. Then all the moving will be constant instead of reproducing the same pose twice. There's no reason to accentuate something unless it's important.

Since somebody else has already started, I would like to make one more point. The entering velocity of all of your starting keyframes much match their respective exiting keyframes to ensure a continous animation curve.

Like they say...a picture speaks a thousand words. And trust me, I've had to resort to a thousand words in my time...let me tell you he he he....ehhh....right.

So yah!

In the first illustration, here's the tilt of the "body". Notice how I've leaned it forward, maybe even a little more forward than in a regular standing pose. This is because the body is being propelled forward, and a little lean is what the body does to give it a little help to move along....what physicists refer to as "inertia". Using gravity and physics to create momentum.

In the second illustration, here are the main key poses of a standard walk.

Richard Williams described a walk as "a series of controlled falls". You start to fall forward, and catch yourself at the last second before you fall flat on your face.

At the main key poses...(the first and last key drawing in my illustration), height of the body is around the mid-point. Right after the main key pose, the body will drop a little to take the weight of the body...it's where the weight of the body falls onto the feet. At the passing positioin, the head level is the highest, then the foot "catches" the body from falling forward back to the main key, which is the last pose that you'll see in the illustration.

Sure there are countless ways to approach the walk cycle, but like they say.."learn the rules before you can master the art of breaking them". Getting a standard walk cycle down pat is a HUGE accomplishment, and once you've gotten that, experimenting with different walks will be much easier.

And once you've reached the walk that you're happy with, for your next one, give your character arms, legs, shoulders, legs and a neck. This'll take you onto new elements that are a blast to animate, and end in wonderful results.

It's refreshing to see how ambitious you are, that how determined you are to get this right...you really do have a passion for animating to take this on...you'll be very grateful you did in the long run.

Adam

And here's the walk cycle.