Do you think kids enjoy any of the religious entertainment out there? I could go on and on, but it occurs to me that maybe my argument is slightly flawed, since all the old fairytales have some sort of moral or message, so I'll leave it at that.
I completely agree with you, with the exception of the VeggieTales, which are heads and shoulders above even most televised children's programming today, not just religious animation. I guess there are people out there that enjoy Focus on the Family's "Odyssey" series (Oddworld corrupted me - I can't even spell that word, anymore. I had to spell check it.) My version of hell would be Odyssey on endless loop.
Even 3-2-1 Penguins, made by the Veggie people, wasn't that good. IMHO, they should sue the shorts off Dreamworks for the Madagascar Penguins.
The National Film Board of Canada has produced a lot of excellent and innovative animation. I saw quite a few of their films as a child, but I haven't seen any for a long time. Norman McLaren was the director (of the film board, not of all the films). I saw a very good ad for war bonds which he made.
This is an understatement! I can't get enough of their animations. McLaren's "Neighbors" is fantastic! I wish there was more of a market for this sort of thing. I'd really love watching (and producing myself for that matter) more quality indy stuff.
Some of my favourite cartoons are the public domain cartoons over at Archive.org
I particularly like the John Sutherland productions. It doesn't matter if you agree with the politics they are pushing or not, they're just very well made. I think Sutherland had something like 20 years experience at Disney's, so he knew a thing or two about cartoon-making.
Has anyone here seen Twice Upon a Time, (directed by John Korty and Charles Swenson)? The animation in that film is incredibly complex and surreal--bordering on alarming. It's a totally different world in there.
I watched this movie once when I was a kid, and would highly recommend it (nevermind that it gave me nightmares for a week).
I recently saw a movie called "The Tune". I think the animator's name was Bill Plympton. The show was just kaleidoscopic. I've not really seen anything like it from the mainstream folks. Good luck finding it, though. I've been looking for a few weeks now, and it seems like nobody knows about it.
Okay, The Tune (which is currently available on DVD) is going on my to-see list.
I've seen much of Plympton's work and so far Mutant Aliens is my favorite.
Trivia: Turned down a 7-figure offer from Disney to animate "Aladdin," because any ideas he developed while under contract with them would become their intellectual property.
Trivia: Turned down a 7-figure offer from Disney to animate "Aladdin," because any ideas he developed while under contract with them would become their intellectual property.
This is close to what happened. The intellectual property part is absolutely true, but the reason he turned down the Disney offer is because the geniuses there wouldn't tell him why they wanted to hire him before he signed the contract. He says he was afraid he'd end up on "Ducktales" or something like that. He didn't find out until later that they wanted him for the Genie in Aladdin due to all the transformation stuff he does in his shorts.
I loved the cartoon fluppy dogs. It apparently was a pilot for what was to be a series but it was never released in any format. It came on The Disney Channel a bit in the 90's but not anymore. We should probably all write Disney begging them to broadcast it.lol. Its cute like the Gummi Bears and fun. You can search online for more information.
You know, I may be stoned for saying this, but I've never seen Watership Down (and many other movies mentioned here). What's the easiest way I could get my hands on it?
I provided a link above to purchase the Watership Down DVD. You can also rent it.
Dunno if it's been mentionned yet, but "Triplets of Belleville" was a movie I really enjoyed for its blend of 2d and 3d elements as well as the story being almost completely visual with very little narative.
I thought the designs of the characters were well done as well as the expressions. Oh and the dog was awesome!:D
Norstein's work is amazing - even moreso when you consider the rudimentary tools and equipment he had to work with. The camera stand he used was essentially homemade, and his puppets were fashioned out of the foil tops from yogurt containers. I had the pleasure of seeing him speak once - an amazing artist.
Pom Poko and Only Yesterday are both great films by Isao Takahata. Pom Poko is rather bizarre but in a good way.
Grave of the Fireflies is also a great movie by Takahata.
None of these films have recieved and wide recognition in the U.S. especially Only Yesterday.
I haven't been able to find a DVD copy of Only Yesterday. Anyone have any idea where i can get my hands on one? I taped it and Pom Poko (which thankfully is now released by Disney) off of TMC when it aired.
I thought Pom Poko was too long in the sense it was kind of boring...I had to force myself to watch it all. Not that I hate Takahata, but I thought Pom Poko could've achieved better results if they had shortened it.
I hate it when movies go on for too long with nothing new to show for the extra screen time, but the parade scene was pretty interesting. :D
Haven't seen Only Yesterday but I have seen some japanese commercials of it.
I wasn't a huge fan of Ferngully, but my son LOVED it.
There was an absolutely delightful animated series of Beatrix Potter stories that I would love to find. They're true to the books, have a painterly quality and a lot of character.
Switching to the darker side, I'm a big (HUGE) fan of The Brothers Quay ("Tales from Vienna Woods", "Street of Crockodiles"). When I first saw their work I was blown away. I went looking for their inspirations, Bruno Schulz the author of "Street of Crockodiles" as well as Jan Svankmeyers ("Faust", Alice). http://ironwork.jp/monkey_farm/papet/papet1.html It's been a real trip.
Not that he's overlooked but Terry Gilliam is a fav and he's so FUNNY!!!
I just got the Pink Panther first series and I'm amazed at how simple and clever it is. And the music ...!
Lastly, the School House Rock series is simply wonderful. I like it, the kids like it, the music and lyrics are some of the best out there and they tell complex stories in an enjoyable, memorable way.
There was an absolutely delightful animated series of Beatrix Potter stories that I would love to find. They're true to the books, have a painterly quality and a lot of character.
Those are out on DVD. I'll have to check them out.
If you are a Richard Williams fan, you probably know a little bit about The Thief and the Cobbler. Recently a guy named Garrett Gilchrist put together a kind of "directors cut" of what the film could have been based on all kinds of footage he "cobbled" together. You kind find lots more about it here:
He will send you a DVD for $10. I got it and it is very interesting. Some the animation is really interesting. Williams considered this his life's work. I'm not a huge fan of the story as a whole, but the piece itself is a must see if you are an animation fan. The officially released versions are nothing like it was really supposed to be (and of course some of the blame for this lies with Williams). More info on the film here:
As to the movie Twice Upon a Time - it was also never released as intended due to problems. To me it looks amazing and I am still trying to get my hands on it, but apparently the release pales in comparison to what it could have been. A wikipedia page on this one is somewhat incomplete:
Lastly, if you have never seen "The Snowman" - it is a MUST see. There is a children's book of which it is based upon, and the animated film followed in 1982. But it is really amazing. It was nominated for an Oscar in 83. We studied this film in animation class at Columbia.
The camera moves during the flying scene are some of the finest pieces of animation I have ever seen and the story is wonderful. It has such an incredibly warm feeling to the film even with a sad ending.
Of note:
"In a list of the 100 Greatest British Television Programmes drawn up by the British Film Institute in 2000, voted for by industry professionals, the film was placed 71st."
I loved the book the Snowman, never seen the animated version, will have to look for it. Too bad they don't show it on satelite at Christmas time, but I've yet to see it listed.
I'm not a huge fan of the story as a whole, but the piece itself is a must see if you are an animation fan. The officially released versions are nothing like it was really supposed to be ...
I agree with the quoted sentiment. There is some beautiful stuff here, but the story, editing, character designs, and characterizations have problems. Saddest of all is watching the ending fall apart.
It has qualities that are similar to Bakshi, Tim Burton, and Yellow Submarine.
Those familiar with Roger Rabbit will recognize the disjoined and weightless animation style.
True fans of the American animated feature should feel obligated to see this version of this movie, as it represents an independent vision.
Yeah, some of the backgrounds are unreal. Even look at the pattern behind the princess's head. The way he did smoke was really neat too. But yeah it does fall apart. But it's an interesting study.
I completely agree with you, with the exception of the VeggieTales, which are heads and shoulders above even most televised children's programming today, not just religious animation. I guess there are people out there that enjoy Focus on the Family's "Odyssey" series (Oddworld corrupted me - I can't even spell that word, anymore. I had to spell check it.) My version of hell would be Odyssey on endless loop.
Even 3-2-1 Penguins, made by the Veggie people, wasn't that good. IMHO, they should sue the shorts off Dreamworks for the Madagascar Penguins.
The Secret of Nimh is one which I think has been forgotten, but is worth seing if you haven't seen it or viewed it in a while.
Pat Hacker, Visit Scooter's World.
This is an understatement! I can't get enough of their animations. McLaren's "Neighbors" is fantastic! I wish there was more of a market for this sort of thing. I'd really love watching (and producing myself for that matter) more quality indy stuff.
Producing solidily ok animation since 2001.
www.galaxy12.com
Now with more doodling!
www.galaxy12.com/latenight
Some of my favourite cartoons are the public domain cartoons over at Archive.org
I particularly like the John Sutherland productions. It doesn't matter if you agree with the politics they are pushing or not, they're just very well made. I think Sutherland had something like 20 years experience at Disney's, so he knew a thing or two about cartoon-making.
John Sutherland Productions at archive.org
Other under-rated cartoons I like are the Disney features Ichabod & Mr. Toad and Melody Time, and also Halas & Batchelor's Animal Farm.
More modern films: Cats don't Dance, Bartok the Magnificent(surprisingly enough, this dtv flick is among Bluth's best ever).
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00005UF84/102-9217709-5921769?v=glance&n=130&n=507846&s=dvd&v=glance
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00005JO3A/102-9217709-5921769?v=glance&n=130&s=dvd&v=glance
I saw both of these not too long ago and now I wish Martin Rosen had directed more animated movies.
Both are directed by Rosen, both are based on novels by Richard Adams (who also wrote a novel about a bear), and both star John Hurt.
Has anyone here seen Twice Upon a Time, (directed by John Korty and Charles Swenson)? The animation in that film is incredibly complex and surreal--bordering on alarming. It's a totally different world in there.
I watched this movie once when I was a kid, and would highly recommend it (nevermind that it gave me nightmares for a week).
Pooryorik
Cats Don't Dance was a severaly underated movie, that was fantastically animated with a great story. If you haven't seen it please do.
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000069I0H/103-2805669-1221429?v=glance&n=130&n=507846&s=dvd&v=glance
Ontiaous
Black Anvil Designs©
I recently saw a movie called "The Tune". I think the animator's name was Bill Plympton. The show was just kaleidoscopic. I've not really seen anything like it from the mainstream folks. Good luck finding it, though. I've been looking for a few weeks now, and it seems like nobody knows about it.
Okay, The Tune (which is currently available on DVD) is going on my to-see list.
I've seen much of Plympton's work and so far Mutant Aliens is my favorite.
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00008ZZ8O/102-9217709-5921769?v=glance&n=130&n=507846&s=dvd&v=glance
Was Hair High ever released?
Yep, but it was pretty limited. I think it only had a couple of screenings around here, and I live near a major population center...
This is close to what happened. The intellectual property part is absolutely true, but the reason he turned down the Disney offer is because the geniuses there wouldn't tell him why they wanted to hire him before he signed the contract. He says he was afraid he'd end up on "Ducktales" or something like that. He didn't find out until later that they wanted him for the Genie in Aladdin due to all the transformation stuff he does in his shorts.
I loved the cartoon fluppy dogs. It apparently was a pilot for what was to be a series but it was never released in any format. It came on The Disney Channel a bit in the 90's but not anymore. We should probably all write Disney begging them to broadcast it.lol. Its cute like the Gummi Bears and fun. You can search online for more information.
gavvalion:)
I provided a link above to purchase the Watership Down DVD. You can also rent it.
I'd like to suggest a look at the Aaron Augenblick website.
http://www.augenblickstudios.com/home/arcade.html
He's responsible for the hilarious animation on the MTV2 parody show, Wonder Showzen.
I might have been over this already, but I'd also like to recommend the Yuri Norstein (or Yuriy Norshteyn) DVD.
http://store.russiananimation.com/cowoofyunodv.html
http://bartondvd.com/dvdcompare3.php?id=366 (scroll down for screenshots)
Being Russian, it might be too grim for some people. It's also very beautiful.
Dunno if it's been mentionned yet, but "Triplets of Belleville" was a movie I really enjoyed for its blend of 2d and 3d elements as well as the story being almost completely visual with very little narative.
I thought the designs of the characters were well done as well as the expressions. Oh and the dog was awesome!:D
Norstein's work is amazing - even moreso when you consider the rudimentary tools and equipment he had to work with. The camera stand he used was essentially homemade, and his puppets were fashioned out of the foil tops from yogurt containers. I had the pleasure of seeing him speak once - an amazing artist.
"Grim" is the wrong word.
"Melancholy" or "bittersweet" are better words.
EDIT: Those two are wrong as well.
"Contemplative" is better. :o
Pom Poko and Only Yesterday are both great films by Isao Takahata. Pom Poko is rather bizarre but in a good way.
Grave of the Fireflies is also a great movie by Takahata.
None of these films have recieved and wide recognition in the U.S. especially Only Yesterday.
I haven't been able to find a DVD copy of Only Yesterday. Anyone have any idea where i can get my hands on one? I taped it and Pom Poko (which thankfully is now released by Disney) off of TMC when it aired.
James :cool:
I thought Pom Poko was too long in the sense it was kind of boring...I had to force myself to watch it all. Not that I hate Takahata, but I thought Pom Poko could've achieved better results if they had shortened it.
I hate it when movies go on for too long with nothing new to show for the extra screen time, but the parade scene was pretty interesting. :D
Haven't seen Only Yesterday but I have seen some japanese commercials of it.
I wasn't a huge fan of Ferngully, but my son LOVED it.
There was an absolutely delightful animated series of Beatrix Potter stories that I would love to find. They're true to the books, have a painterly quality and a lot of character.
Switching to the darker side, I'm a big (HUGE) fan of The Brothers Quay ("Tales from Vienna Woods", "Street of Crockodiles"). When I first saw their work I was blown away. I went looking for their inspirations, Bruno Schulz the author of "Street of Crockodiles" as well as Jan Svankmeyers ("Faust", Alice).
http://ironwork.jp/monkey_farm/papet/papet1.html It's been a real trip.
Not that he's overlooked but Terry Gilliam is a fav and he's so FUNNY!!!
I just got the Pink Panther first series and I'm amazed at how simple and clever it is. And the music ...!
Lastly, the School House Rock series is simply wonderful. I like it, the kids like it, the music and lyrics are some of the best out there and they tell complex stories in an enjoyable, memorable way.
Those are out on DVD. I'll have to check them out.
If you are a Richard Williams fan, you probably know a little bit about The Thief and the Cobbler. Recently a guy named Garrett Gilchrist put together a kind of "directors cut" of what the film could have been based on all kinds of footage he "cobbled" together. You kind find lots more about it here:
http://www.originaltrilogy.com/forum/messageview.cfm?catid=11&threadid=4256
He will send you a DVD for $10. I got it and it is very interesting. Some the animation is really interesting. Williams considered this his life's work. I'm not a huge fan of the story as a whole, but the piece itself is a must see if you are an animation fan. The officially released versions are nothing like it was really supposed to be (and of course some of the blame for this lies with Williams). More info on the film here:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_thief_and_the_cobbler
As to the movie Twice Upon a Time - it was also never released as intended due to problems. To me it looks amazing and I am still trying to get my hands on it, but apparently the release pales in comparison to what it could have been. A wikipedia page on this one is somewhat incomplete:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Twice_Upon_a_Time
And here's a more informative fan page:
http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Dimension/9049/twice1.html
I loved Secret of NIMH - one of my favorites. I think it is really well animated. I've never seen Dogs, but it's on my list.
And as others have said, if you have never visited film board of Canada, some of the stuff is unreal. You can see 50 of thier shorts here:
http://www.nfb.ca/animation/objanim/en/films/?PHPSESSID=c89f5de6a020a3bff54bdc5cd4e91ec3
Lastly, if you have never seen "The Snowman" - it is a MUST see. There is a children's book of which it is based upon, and the animated film followed in 1982. But it is really amazing. It was nominated for an Oscar in 83. We studied this film in animation class at Columbia.
The camera moves during the flying scene are some of the finest pieces of animation I have ever seen and the story is wonderful. It has such an incredibly warm feeling to the film even with a sad ending.
Info page:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Snowman
Of note:
"In a list of the 100 Greatest British Television Programmes drawn up by the British Film Institute in 2000, voted for by industry professionals, the film was placed 71st."
I loved the book the Snowman, never seen the animated version, will have to look for it. Too bad they don't show it on satelite at Christmas time, but I've yet to see it listed.
Pat Hacker, Visit Scooter's World.
I agree with the quoted sentiment. There is some beautiful stuff here, but the story, editing, character designs, and characterizations have problems. Saddest of all is watching the ending fall apart.
It has qualities that are similar to Bakshi, Tim Burton, and Yellow Submarine.
Those familiar with Roger Rabbit will recognize the disjoined and weightless animation style.
True fans of the American animated feature should feel obligated to see this version of this movie, as it represents an independent vision.
Yeah, some of the backgrounds are unreal. Even look at the pattern behind the princess's head. The way he did smoke was really neat too. But yeah it does fall apart. But it's an interesting study.
Those are really good. I have all of them on VHS.
James
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