could anyone tell me where i could get an animation grant?

If you won't allow yourself to believe anything else, then of course it's going to stay true for you. He's just trying to help.

Not sure of the point you're trying to make, or if the point you're trying to make is to yourself. A great teacher at a great school will give you a good headstart.

But 'success'? Do you mean landing a job at a big studio and pulling down a big salary? Getting to work on a project you are passionate about? Doing your own thing, creating the animated films YOU want to watch, making the statements YOU want to make? What is 'success' to you? I know dudes who've won at Cannes that still feel a bit of a failure, and guys who post toons online for a handful of eager fans who're as happy as pigs in shit.

Let me quote something back to you:

t's not like back in the day when you could start out on your own and you had a good chance to succeed

It's not like back in the day, it's better. There's more shops. There's the internet. There's more channels. There's more outlets for indies. There's cellphones, video games, podcasts, flash. There's cheap PC's and 3d programs you can actually afford. There's books, there's videos, there's online training. There's a thousand more directions you can take your education in than there was when I started out, on my own.

Doing it outside the 'system' constantly from start to end is a dark, quiet road, with many locked doors, and little light. Starting in the 'system' at the very miniumum gives a broader perspective for future endeavour

Dude, you're not even in 'the system' yet! Have you applied for animation work at a shop? Put up anything online? Talked to anybody in the industry about finding work post-college? Finding a college? Don't defeat yourself before you've even stepped onto the battlefield.

And an earlier quote:

Suppose it's common sense really, the centre of animation is and always has been in the Cali vacinity, and the best gravitate there. Obviously this is a generality, but for most it is the case.

Absolute, patent horseshit. It all comes from Cali. Fuck Cali. What about Aardman? Nelvana? Atomic? Studio Ghibli? Soyuz Multifilm? Spumco? Copernicus? Fat Katz? TMS? Studio B? All the great work these studios have produced, all of it is inconsequential because they're not studios from California?

Jessica Borutsky? Bill Plympton? Ryan Larkin? Peter Lord? Andreas Hykade?
Johnen Vasquez? John Kricfalusi? Fantasitc work from the lot of 'em, but it don't count becuz they didn't graduate from CalArts? Don't buy it.

Hell, I learned my chops from a tiny lil' college in northern Ontario...I've been steadily employed for 10 freakin' years. But, I guess I'm not successful, because I didn't come out of Orange County? Come on, you can see yerself how absurd that sounds.

Enough. Find yerself a good school, find a way to get in it, then take it from there. Best of luck, mate. Really.

Dude, you're not even in 'the system' yet! Have you applied for animation work at a shop? Put up anything online? Talked to anybody in the industry about finding work post-college? Finding a college? Don't defeat yourself before you've even stepped onto the battlefield.

Lol, that's my whole point, i first said i'm looking to get into the system to educate myself and nurture ideas (e.g, good ani program at a college with good outlets for experience in the field etc), but need the spondoolahs to do so yadah yadah yadah, and you suggested going around it, hence the debate! Going around it entirely in my situation (and mostly everyone's situation i would imagine) is very dangerous, especially for me, which i can demonstrate by answering the Q's in the above quote (amongst many over things):

a) I can't be legally employed in the states under any visa (cept one i'm not valid for), and thus cannot walk into places and 'work in a shop'. Sure, there are ways around this, like knowing someone who hires you as help etc 'for free' >cough cough, wink wink<, I will try with all my typing and vocal power to contact peeps that can help me in this way, but that relies on knowing someone quite well for them to risk themselves and/or their buisness by 'hiring' someone like me (who is essentially a Majority Minority i.e. ICED PIGS in a foreign country) My only joy is under the student visa (where you can work on campus), which i couldn't get if i can't afford to go uni anyway!
b) I'm Working on my site atm, but it's taking a lil time as most of my stuff was made for a portfolio type reel or for dvd viewing (ie. largish filesizes). This is due partly to the fact i didn't know much about web design a while ago. But having a website is a great outlet for your work and ideas, so i'm currently learning the ins and outs of web design as i ramble on.
c) And yup talked to folks bout post college work, as that is unfortunatley one of the only opps for a green card for me and indeed my family (who have moved here to live) *it's very toit for brits to do anything here other than spend money. So, it's defo a big issue for me to mull over, but first and foremost, i need to attend a college to worry more about post-college (more specifically, a college with good possibilties of post-college work).

Absolute, patent horseshit. It all comes from Cali. Fuck Cali. What about Aardman? Nelvana? Atomic? Studio Ghibli? Soyuz Multifilm? Spumco? Copernicus? Fat Katz? TMS? Studio B? All the great work these studios have produced, all of it is inconsequential because they're not studios from California?

Jessica Borutsky? Bill Plympton? Ryan Larkin? Peter Lord? Andreas Hykade?
Johnen Vasquez? John Kricfalusi? Fantasitc work from the lot of 'em, but it don't count becuz they didn't graduate from CalArts? Don't buy it.

Stop reaading the stuff in my response that will give you a good answer, and read the whole response. You ever worked in media?
First, no one said it all comes from Cali, becus you're right, that is nappy-shit (why wud i even consider wanting to get into animation if i believed that, coming from the south of England?!) But fucking Cali isn't gonna help you at all. So you'd choose to not learn anything from the 'Cali' animation representatives simply because you hold a grudge against them cus' they're based in that state? You'd miss out a whole chunk of animation knowledge my friend, nobodies like Pixar, Disney, Dreamworks, WBros (to name the easy ones) can't help you at all, right? Stop making Cali into 'the man' and use them beneficially for both personal goals and animation as a whole, just like you should look at stuff outside Cali! Jeez... it's not a war!

Look i appreciate you trying to help me, but it's hard when you don't understand what i want to do. And that is look for funding to get into a decent animation program!! Not debate the politics of a 100+ year old industry...

Do whatever ya feel the need to do, kid.

At fifteen I'd start with my high school counselor. See what she/he has to say. They have lists of community organizations that are willing to fund educational projects. Groups like the Kiwanis are especially interested in children's programs. Other groups like local art associations have some funds that they use towards promoting the arts for youth. At fifteen you haven't been exposed much to the resources that are available, but your counselor should be up on them.

At fifteen I'd start with my high school counselor. See what she/he has to say. They have lists of community organizations that are willing to fund educational projects. Groups like the Kiwanis are especially interested in children's programs. Other groups like local art associations have some funds that they use towards promoting the arts for youth. At fifteen you haven't been exposed much to the resources that are available, but your counselor should be up on them.

Phacker is one hundred percent (100%) right, your school counselor is the best starting place. Post a message if this does not work.

And don't just ask the counselor when you catch them in the corridor, make an appointment and come prepared with samples of your work. Look at it as a rehearsal for a pitch later on, show your counselor how serious you are about your work. If you can do that they should be able to put you together with some resources. At the very least they will know how serious you are about your project. Later when you are ready to apply to animation schools they'll remember your efforts and it will work for you in that regard also.

It has nothing to do with how much money your school has. If you school has enough to hire a counselor, they hired that person to have knowledge of the resources offered by the community. It they plead ignorace, they are just plain lazy and accepting a paycheck for doing nothing. I don't buy that and you and your parent's shouldn't either. Someone should contact the administrator.

If you want online grants do a Google like the rest of us do and do your own research. I don't think you actually contacted your counselor.

Go online and do a Google search for arts groups in your community or state. If you can't find anything online, bop on down to yer local library. They should be able to steer you in the right direction. Also, have you tried talking to your school's art teacher? I'm assuming you've got one.

My big question is, what do you need the grant for? Music? Software? Hardware? Your budget might be calling for things that you just don't need. Gimme a lil' bit more info on what yer workin' on (length of film, type of animation, state of project) and I might be able to get you a lil' more info.

For example, there are tons of great flash animators online who do it all on the cheap. All you need to get started is a demo version of Adobe Flash and a PC with internet access. There's FlashKit, an online flash developers site with tons of freeware fonts, sounds, and open-source files for you to look at. And, a full version of flash can be bought for $300-400 with a student discount.

There are also 'on the cheap' solutions for doing things in 3d and stop-motion. AWN articles are a great place to look for books and other resources. And again, there's tons of free goodness on teh interweb to get you going.

Like I said, a lil' more info on what yer workin' on, and I can steer ya in the right direction. Good Luck!

Hey!

As TD said start with your local arts council, or county arts council- then state's art councils.

If your film has a particular theme (such as an environmental topic) you might want to approach a group that champions that topic...again, begin with the local folks and work out from there.

Check to see if a local filmmakers club exists...check under all the rocks...

Good Hunting!

I will be looking for the same typa aid, just for a different cause. Namely education (i'm gonna be an international student, so theres limited too no financial aid out there).

The hefty cost of a decent animation education for someone starting out in the buisness (ie. has no access to intraining within decent studios, apart from my own devices), has made it increasingly hard for someone such as myself (from UK) to come over here and learn from the best (cus at the end of day, why learn anything else?)

So one of my (only) means of affording said costs is the possibility of grants. Now for me, i do not have the option of walking into my local school counciler, as a) i've moved to here from the UK and b) in the UK the only thing remotley like a US school counsiler i found in my school or any school was useless (mainly becus it was also my school's resident english teacher posing as both).

I have researched alot, and found some possibilties, but am waiting atm to write the perfect 'begging' letter to these small few, as i have to face the fact that becus there are so little out there for me too write too, i cannot afford to fail in drawing them into my cause. Also, grants in general seem to be for artists looking to 'do' work, not 'learn' how to do the work. That meaning most grant organizations have stipulations not allowing grant aids for schooling. Which needless to say, sucks so hard its dry!

Any help out there? Know of any possibilties? Anything mentioned is all good...

Thanks,
Rich.

I wouldn't wait too long RTP. You never know when these organizations will make their decisions (it often happens before any stated deadlines), and by waiting you may be taking yourself out of contention. If you have a compelling story, you'll get the money. If not, it won't matter when you send it in.

The home of Aardman and Channel Four, and you want to jump ship stateside to learn teh amination? Of course, I'm gonna assume that animation is primarily taught in fine arts colleges in England, and that has gotta cost boo-coo bucks. I thought about Animation Mentor, here's the link:

[url]http://www.animationmentor.com/[url]

Tuition is a lil' on the extreme side, if I may be blunt...16 grand seems a lil' stiff for an online course, but I've heard great stuff about these guys, and seen some sample student work...posted on this forum, actually. Student loan financing is available, so you might wanna take a look.

Yeah, i visited the best in Eng, outta curiosity mostly, and facility wise, it was very poor in comparison to the top tier in the US (especially the ones i've visited). Some good work produced at the UK ones (or the stuff they had shown me, aka their best front), but on an international level, consitently not good enough for what i feel my self wanting to do.

Suppose it's common sense really, the centre of animation is and always has been in the Cali vacinity, and the best gravitate there. Obviously this is a generality, but for most it is the case.

And in the same regard, i feel i would gain alot more from learning the art there, rather than somewhere else that has adopted it from there, kinda like second hand knowledge in a way.

Perhaps not everyone's opinion, but it certainly is mine.

Also, i feel that animation is a very team orientated thing, and whilst you may be able to learn the 'book' (ie. the technical) stuff down to a tee on an online 'college', you simply can't grasp everything you could learn at an actual physical college.

However, you also pay for what you get, perhaps even more than what you get in some colleges, and that unfortunatley, is a big aspect.

Potentially a great animator could never be what he or she could be, simply because the starting step was too costly to step on too. What could have been will never be... S'pose it's the same with almost all things, damn politics! lol

Anyways, to sum up, i came here for a reason, and in this case, it's not online colleges. ;)

Potentially a great animator could never be what he or she could be, simply because the starting step was too costly to step on too. What could have been will never be... S'pose it's the same with almost all things, damn politics! lol

O.k., you need to lose that shit poste haste, mon vieux...yeah, it's a great idea to have a great school to go to, but it's your talent and passion that are gonna be what set you apart. Sure, there's tons of guys out there, really talented dudes from Calarts, Sheridan, Ringling...there are just as many who went to mainstream colleges, dropped out and did freakin' faboolus (John K. comes to mind) and just as many who are self-taught...grabbed themselves some books, hopped online or mentored with another animator in their hometown.

Just like the martial arts or playing an instrument, hell, just like ANYTHING worth doing, if you really, REALLY want to do it, you'll find yerself a way. I applied to two art schools back in my teenage years, got rejected by both. Then, I got my art fundies from a correspondence course while workin' a shit job in a tiny lil' atlantic town...did that for two years. Applied to college, but didn't have the money; worked for another year and used an unemployement insurance program to get to school. Two years later, I graduated, went to Toronto for a one-month gig, and I've been here ever since. Stuff needs to be updated, but my site's here:

http://www.neillyworks.com

Find a good school and get a loan. Send some emails to animators you know and find out how they did it...not everybody comes from money! Check out some links off of Jerry Beck's Cartoon Brew...hell, send Jerry an e-mail!

http://www.cartoonbrew.com

Check out the AWN bookstore and get yerself some book learnin' in the meantime...not the same as having a master, but it's the next best thing. Above all, TRY EVERYTHING YOU CAN THINK OF. If ya really want do be doing da animation, you'll find yerself a way. Hell, I did. At the end of the day, any studio worth their salt is only gonna care about what's in yer demo reel and in your portfolio. And if you love whatcher doin', it'll show in what you put down in paper and/or pixels. Cheers, mate, and keep us all posted!

O.k., you need to lose that shit poste haste, mon vieux...yeah, it's a great idea to have a great school to go to, but it's your talent and passion that are gonna be what set you apart.

You've kinda reinforced my point. Talented people can struggle to get into these 'great schools'. And as talented as one can be, if there is no outlet for this talent, it is wasted.

Talent and passion set you apart, but it's who divides them who has the power....

And i totally agree with you, people should want to make it by their own means. I've always wanted to do so, and always will. it's certainly wise to think that way, but it isn't wise to think that believing you'll make it on your own, will mean all things will go that way. It's not like back in the day when you could start out on your own and you had a good chance to succeed, there is a 'system' now, and to overlook it is nieve and unrealistic. The people who had free reigns way back when made the 'system' that is today, and people coming along now like me and everyone else have to accept it, or rather, understand it.

And when i dream of doing things my way, i have to look at this 'system' and realise it's still here that way because it is built on success, so learning from it is a great start in this field. Take Picasso, he learnt to create art in outstanding ways under the more 'mainstream' techniques first, then went onto to do more extreme, more personally intouch and unique works afterwards.

Doing it outside the 'system' constantly from start to end is a dark, quiet road, with many locked doors, and little light.

Starting in the 'system' at the very miniumum gives a broader perspective for future endeavours (and of course learning from the best can't hurt....)

A little insulting too that i have to explain this, it's not like i just woke up and decided ok, this is what i'll do today, but hey, some things get lost in the translation. ;)